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Author Topic: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)  (Read 1325 times)
flyrobynfly
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #75 on: December 04, 2006, 08:48:02 PM »

OK here goes I too was an adult rape victim and also repeatedly raped as a child I take these kind of scenes maybe too seriously I'm always looking at internal thoughts of the victims maybe it's because of my personal experiences.� I totally agree never ever let the aggressor win, which is why today I am a happy go lucky determined positive person who only wants the best for me, but I do take these things serious and again maybe too serious, I wonder was Hannah really OK afterwards or does she still have demons to deal with.
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"Can I be blunt on this subject? If you don�t have time to read, you don�t have the time (or the tools) to write. Simple as that. Reading is the creative center of a writer�s life."  - Stephen King
mary024
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #76 on: December 04, 2006, 08:59:12 PM »

Hannah has the incredible advantage of having such wonderful female role models and leaders.  I think her heritage plays a very vital role in how she deals with any life altering situation.

When I had to face my own rape, my own culture played a crucial role in how I dealt with it.  I'm of asian descent, from a very male dominated culture - with the expectation of obedience, submissiveness and meekness.  There was shame, guilt, fear and anger - with a family duty of maintaining appearances and reputation. 

I think it's very different for Hannah.  She comes from a culture where a woman has a choice to choose her path.  She is allowed to find herself freely.
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flyrobynfly
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #77 on: December 04, 2006, 09:07:07 PM »

I think it's very different for Hannah. She comes from a culture where a woman has a choice to choose her path. She is allowed to find herself freely.
Good point Mary, I never took in consideration her culture and beliefs.
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"Can I be blunt on this subject? If you don�t have time to read, you don�t have the time (or the tools) to write. Simple as that. Reading is the creative center of a writer�s life."  - Stephen King
Rosina (aka Sara)
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #78 on: December 05, 2006, 01:30:02 AM »

I am more than a little taken aback at the personal stories here. That the three of you survived and found the strength to heal is a real testament to the power of the human spirit.

For me personally, I have never had this experience and hope I never will. Friends, yes, and a relative, so all my understanding of the trauma and aftermath is second hand. When I write about things like this, terrible things that happen to normal people, I have to stretch to the breaking point in order to try to get into their heads. This is the real challenge in writing this kind of story. Not only trying to get into Hannah's frame of mind in that attack, but also into Nathaniel's when he chose not to extend a hand to Billy Kirby, and did just the opposite, sent him to his death. I don't think I could do that, but Nathaniel could, and in his head I could see how and why it happened that way. There are dozens of situations like that in the books, but by far the most challenging one was this rape scene.

There was one other scene where there was an attempted rape, but otherwise I have stayed away from this particular kind of tragedy because I didn't know if I could pull it off. This time Hannah made it clear to me that the story was going in that direction, and that I'd have to try to follow her. I didn't do it lightly. I really dislike authors who sprinkle rapes throughout their books. I find it gratuitous.

In this case, Hannah has been in some very tough situations. She has seen murder up close on the battlefield and off it; she has seen children killed by soldiers, and she has treated women raped in the aftermath of battle. These things are very real to her, and so when she experienced the attack herself first hand she brought a certain reservoir of knowledge and understanding with her. Not that she didn't suffer, and require time to heal. Of course she did. But it seems to me that for a modern day woman (unless she lives in Darfur or Rwanda or Bosnia or Bagdad) it's almost impossible to imagine the kind of life Hannah led while she was in the west, and how that influenced the way she lived her life and reacted to things as common as childbirth or as traumatic as rape.
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Rosina
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MistyDawn
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #79 on: December 05, 2006, 07:51:40 AM »

Just to give a different perspective...
I was molested for a few years as a child, and later in an abusive relationship as a young adult.� My dad found out after the fact on both of these issues.� He called me last night to tell me that he finished the book and thought it was excellent.� Then he commented that what happened to Hannah was hard for him to take and that he had to set the book down and pace for awhile, then he went out hunting (shooting a gun is good therapy for him ).� I realize that this was his way of telling me that he was imagining his daughter's struggles as he read.
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mary024
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #80 on: December 05, 2006, 08:02:02 AM »

In this case, Hannah has been in some very tough situations. She has seen murder up close on the battlefield and off it; she has seen children killed by soldiers, and she has treated women raped in the aftermath of battle. These things are very real to her, and so when she experienced the attack herself first hand she brought a certain reservoir of knowledge and understanding with her.

ITA with this.� This helped me to really understand Hannah and how she made her way through life.� Not to diminish the horror or trauma of rape - but what helped me during my healing process was knowing that there are worse things that could happen to me.� I wouldn't let this break me.� For Hannah, she has lived through some very horrific experiences - has witnessed the very worse of human nature that have directly and indirectly impacted her life, and she's managed to walk away from it with her head on her shoulders.� Her suffering was a little more evident in QOS - and we did get a glimpse into that unresolved pain.�
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flyrobynfly
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #81 on: December 05, 2006, 08:27:29 AM »

In this case, Hannah has been in some very tough situations. She has seen murder up close on the battlefield and off it; she has seen children killed by soldiers, and she has treated women raped in the aftermath of battle. These things are very real to her, and so when she experienced the attack herself first hand she brought a certain reservoir of knowledge and understanding with her. Not that she didn't suffer, and require time to heal. Of course she did. But it seems to me that for a modern day woman (unless she lives in Darfur or Rwanda or Bosnia or Bagdad) it's almost impossible to imagine the kind of life Hannah led while she was in the west, and how that influenced the way she lived her life and reacted to things as common as childbirth or as traumatic as rape.
I have a better understanding on this, the simple fact that Hannah buried her child and walked back home to her family and learned to smile again should have been enough of a reminder of Hannah's pure strength and will of character.

Perhaps I put her in a modern situtation, the rape was so degradingly disgusting (as they all are) and I think you did such a good job depicting the scene, her turning into herself etc... that I was there and then put the situtation into modern times not taking into consideration her history only mine.�� As I read the scene I kept hoping that he wouldn't rape her, maybe he'd beat her afterall a man who could send his own flesh and blood to slavery/death is capable of anything but the rape just made me stand up and I spent some time after in the book wondering about her reaction how she was going to cope.� I have survived multiple rapes and abuse on my person most of my early life and adulthood and managed to survive with bells on for that matter but I have never spoken of the experience with other victims/survivors so I didn't know how others have survived.  Thank you ladies for sharing.
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"Can I be blunt on this subject? If you don�t have time to read, you don�t have the time (or the tools) to write. Simple as that. Reading is the creative center of a writer�s life."  - Stephen King
soupiefick
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #82 on: December 05, 2006, 08:44:01 AM »

I also would like to bring up the fact that she had experienced having a loving husband and being a loving mother before all of the horrors of war and losing her husband and son, and experienced all of this before she was raped.

I know part of my "problems" in coming to terms with it came from the fact that this was the first real horror I ever experienced. Almost like skin, the first cut hurts the worst, cuts on scars do not hurt nearly as much and are harder to do.
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KristinaLynn
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #83 on: December 05, 2006, 08:49:17 AM »

I hope that after all this pain, the rest of Hannah's life will be spent in peace. She deserves some happiness and rest after all of the horrors of her past. <Hint hint to the woman who owns the keyboard that types the story>

Now you can throw my hint aside and stomp on it because I know that you know what is best for the story and characters. Just ignor me.. I ramble.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2006, 08:53:56 AM by KristinaLynn » Logged

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malbrec92
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #84 on: December 05, 2006, 09:32:48 AM »

I have been wondering how much attention readers pay to Madame Soileau
Madame Who?� No, I recognize the name, but her backstory was not something I fully grasped on first reading.� I'll pay closer attention on the second reading.� Once again, though, I was never lost in the story.� You provided detail when it was needed to keep me up to speed.

maybe she's just strong and won't let him take her self worth or peace of mind with him but I felt that the rape was dealt with too fast and easy.
I did expect more difficulty healing from her though. I felt it came too easy at times. But, she has lost so much in her life that she found a way to do what it took to move on...� Honore couldn't really destroy the very essence of her. The women in her life taught her that, I think. And her experiences in the past were lessons that reinforced that.

...Hannah comes from a culture where a woman has a choice to choose her path.� She is allowed to find herself freely.
Then again, I am looking at this from a modern perspective. I had help when I needed it, and there is public support for victims. Will it be different in Paradise? Will anyone there know about it? It is a very intriguing turn - I'm interested in seeing the final outcome.
...I have stayed away from this particular kind of tragedy... This time Hannah made it clear to me that the story was going in that direction, and that I'd have to try to follow her. I didn't do it lightly. I really dislike authors who sprinkle rapes throughout their books. I find it gratuitous.
Responding to these comments collectively, I'll start by saying that like Rosina, I dislike gratuitous rape scenes in books.  I was grateful that the act itself was not explicitly detailed.  It was hurtful enough to me as a reader who loves Hannah -- I didn't need (or want) details. 

Regarding Hannah's healing, I think Mary puts it very well.  "She has lost so much in her life that she found a way to do what it took to move on."  Has she moved on?  Yes.  She was able to do this because of her own life experiences and because a huge part of her identity as a woman is her ability to choose her own path.  Still, rape then was essentially the same as it is today.  At some point, she will need help, and it would be interesting to see how it might be handled in early 1800's Paradise, which is decidedly different from today!

Though she's put it behind her, she surely has yet to fully heal.  She will always bear the scars, though they may be well hidden.  Will it come back to haunt her in Paradise?  For her sake, I hope not, but it would be understandable if it did.

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KristinaLynn
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Re: if you've finished Queen of Swords and want to talk about it... (SPOILERS)
« Reply #85 on: December 05, 2006, 11:12:26 AM »

I too am glad that you did not go into detail. But I must say (again and again) Rosina you have a way of writting characters that inspire moving towads the light.

Also, thank you for bringing all of us together. I have found closer in some of my own issues, and comfort in friends that have gone through many of the same things I have gone through. Thanks to you, I met one of my best friends. <waves at Robyn>
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